--- Log opened Tue May 31 00:00:21 2005
--- Day changed Tue May 31 2005
00:00 < rxr> so - me soon asleep ...
00:00 < valentin> sleep well
00:16 < rxr> thanks
00:16 < jeru> good night rxr
00:16 < rxr> oh - not too many updates today ,-)
00:16 < rxr> just run the tracker manually ... - to see what's up ,-)
00:16 < jeru> oh ... not too many time today ;)
00:16 < rxr> oh - not all did arrive - some more ..
00:17 < jeru> rxr: indeed ... this tracker is very helpful :)
00:18 < rxr> yes ,-)
00:18 < rxr> now I need to set it up to patch, regtest and thus automate it even more ...
00:18 < rxr> .o(t2, the self updating system ,-)
00:18 < rxr> so - me curious if how long the sparc overlives building this time
00:18 < rxr> n8 all - finally ...
00:19 < valentin> much luck
00:19 < valentin> gn8 rxr
00:19 < jeru> rxr: but I think we've to run regression test more often 
00:19 < jeru> good night
00:19 < jeru> will goo sleep too 
00:22 -!- jeru [~jeru@p54BFB084.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
00:47 < valentin> gn8 jeru
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02:22 -!- madtux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has joined #t2
02:37 < jsaw> re
02:37 < CIA-9> jsaw * r9254 /trunk/package/develop/lua/ (lua.conf lua.desc): 
02:37 < CIA-9> * update lua (5.0.2 -> 5.1-work6)
02:37 < CIA-9>  (new features justify an update to a beta version)
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02:57 -!- rxr_ [~rene@e178134209.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #t2
02:57 -!- Topic for #t2:  T2 | 2.1.0-beta4 RELEASED | The next generation of System Development Environments (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/
02:57 -!- Topic set by menomc [] [Sat Apr 16 00:33:34 2005]
02:57 [Users #t2]
02:57 [ _Ragnar_   ] [ jsaw  ] [ mtr_] [ rxr_     ] [ sparc-kly[u5]] 
02:57 [ CIA-9      ] [ madtux] [ nzg ] [ SerWou   ] [ valentin     ] 
02:57 [ dualopteron] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ sparc-kly] 
02:57 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 14 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
02:57 -!- [freenode-info] why register and identify?  your IRC nick is how people know you.  http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
02:57 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug  8 21:15:33 2004
02:57 -!- Irssi: Join to #t2 was synced in 11 secs
02:59 -!- keinek [~Keinek@201.254.10.51] has joined #t2
02:59 < keinek> hi
03:02 < sparc-kly> hi
03:13 -!- rxr [~rene@e178130124.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
03:18 -!- madtux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has quit ["Leaving"]
03:18 -!- sparc-kly [~killbox@65-23-199-219.prtc.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
08:22 < rxr_> moin
08:27 -!- You're now known as rxr
08:55 < rxr> hm - sparc still crunchin ,-)
09:01 < rxr> Porting Open Source to Minor Platforms is Harmful
09:01 < rxr> ^- Ulrich Drepper 
09:01 < rxr> http://developers.slashdot.org/developers/05/05/30/2233251.shtml
09:06 < CIA-9> rene * r9255 /trunk/package/audio/cdrdao/ (cdrdao.desc x86_64-support.patch): * updated cdrdao (1.1.9 -> 1.2.0)
09:09 < CIA-9> rene * r9256 /trunk/package/x11/idesk/idesk.desc: * updated idesk (0.7.1 -> 0.7.2)
09:11 < CIA-9> rene * r9257 /trunk/package/x11/fvwm/fvwm.desc: * updated fvwm (2.4.16 -> 2.4.19)
09:15 < CIA-9> rene * r9258 /trunk/package/audio/qjackctl/qjackctl.desc: * updated qjackctl (0.2.14 -> 0.2.15a)
09:28 < CIA-9> rene * r9259 /trunk/package/audio/ (8 files in 6 dirs): 
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-driver (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-lib (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-utils (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-oss (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-firmware (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:28 < CIA-9> * updated alsa-tools (1.0.8 -> 1.0.9)
09:30 < rxr> http://www.heise.de/ct/05/12/003/
10:00 < CIA-9> rene * r9260 /trunk/package/ruby/eruby/eruby.desc: * updated eruby (1.0.3 -> 1.0.5)
10:10 -!- mvhallac [~mvhallac@60-240-146-203.tpgi.com.au] has joined #t2
10:10 < mvhallac> hi
10:11 < rxr> hi mvhallac 
10:12 < mvhallac> I'm quite new to T2. Impressive work. Congrats
10:14 < mvhallac> Got a question about runit, though. Is it working, or should I stay away from it?
10:15 < rxr> some people here use runit
10:15 < rxr> tough I do not ...
10:16 < rxr> so far I did not hear about problem
10:16 < mvhallac> hmn.. I can't get it to compile in stage 1. All those djb scripts mad eme dizzy trying to figure out what's going on. :-)
10:17 < rxr> what did you configure? some embedded target?
10:17 < mvhallac> Something I copied from generic
10:17 < mvhallac> No customizations, but I've got a package selection customization
10:18 < rxr> hm
10:18 < mvhallac> Though my environmnt is a bit suspect. 
10:18 < mvhallac> I'm under debian, in a jail built from t2, bootstrapped from rock BBS.
10:18 < CIA-9> rene * r9261 /trunk/package/scientific/graphviz/graphviz.desc: * updated graphviz (2.2 -> 2.2.1)
10:19 < mvhallac> too adventurous? :-P
10:19 < rxr> mvhallac: you could mail the error to the list - if you like us to take a look
10:20 < rxr> mvhallac: in theory this sound good ...
10:20 < mvhallac> I'm trying the mnemosyne with runit now
10:20 < mvhallac> Are you supposed to have DJB layout, do you know?
10:21 < rxr> with runit? I think so.
10:21 < mvhallac> the error is in djb_safecopy.. It's trying to source from /admin/... instead of using its package dir.
10:22 < rxr> hm - to bad mnemoc is not awake, he is definetly using runit - I have not yet looked into it ..
10:22 < mvhallac> anyway, if this one fails too, I'll try the mail list.
10:23 < mvhallac> BTW. My ultimae goal is to build a network appliance... So something like the router will be what I'll use, I suppose
10:23 < rxr> the router target is a slightly bit rotting
10:23 < mvhallac> How should I go about getting it, do you think? Use one of the provided targets, and add my packages in pkg select rules?
10:23 < mvhallac> Oh.. OK.
10:23 < rxr> using the embedded target as base would be more productive
10:25 < mvhallac> I'll give it a try.
10:25 < mvhallac> Thanks.
10:37 -!- mvhallac [~mvhallac@60-240-146-203.tpgi.com.au] has left #t2 ["Client exiting"]
10:40 < CIA-9> rene * r9262 /trunk/package/games/gens/gens.desc: * updated gens (2.12a-rc2 -> 2.12a-rc3)
10:44 < CIA-9> rene * r9263 /trunk/package/ (emulators/gens/ games/gens/): * moved games/gens into emulators/
10:50 < CIA-9> rene * r9264 /trunk/scripts/Create-PkgUpdPatch: 
10:50 < CIA-9> * reworked scripts/Create-PkgUpdPatch to primarily accept input in the
10:50 < CIA-9>  form pkg ver - and only pkg-ver as fallback
10:50 < CIA-9> * also removed iterating in shell code over all the packages
10:50 < CIA-9> * removed mulitple updates at-a-time support
11:03 < CIA-9> rene * r9265 /trunk/misc/archive/Update.sh: 
11:03 < CIA-9> * changed misc/archive/Update.sh to not use the now deprecated, '-'
11:03 < CIA-9>  seperated way to pass package and version to Create-PkgUpdPatch
11:04 < CIA-9> rene * r9266 /trunk/package/religion/sword/sword.desc: * updated sword (1.5.7a -> 1.5.8)
11:07 -!- madtux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has joined #t2
11:07 < madtux> keinek, awake?
11:07 < rxr> hey miguel!
11:07 < madtux> hello rene
11:07 < madtux> wow u called me miguel
11:07 < madtux> :)
11:07 < rxr> I did so yesterday, as well ,-)
11:07 < rxr> madtux: how are you ?
11:08 < madtux> i am great thanks for asking, and yourself?
11:08 < rxr> oh - great, too
11:09 < madtux> so glad to hear that
11:09 < madtux> :)
11:09 < rxr> what are you work on these days, miguel?
11:10 < rxr> working ...
11:17 < CIA-9> rene * r9267 /trunk/package/base/minit/minit.desc: * fixed minit to build after the new libowfat priority
11:20 < rxr> http://math.holycross.edu/~ahwang/current/ePiX.html
11:20 < rxr> ^- hey - we are listed on that side ,-)
11:29 -!- codetux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has joined #t2
11:39 -!- jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has joined #t2
11:39 < jeru> moin
11:39 < rxr> moin jeru 
11:40 < jeru> hi rxr
11:40 < CIA-9> rene * r9268 /trunk/package/base/fgetty/fgetty.desc: * build fgetty after minit ...
11:40 < rxr> jeru: I'm fixing embedded regressions ...
11:42 < jeru> rxr: hey ... thanks :) I've seen that you changed the build prio of minit .... does it work now ?
11:43 < rxr> == 05/31/05 11:40:31 =[1]=> Finished building package minit.
11:43 < rxr> vanilla embedded
11:43 < jeru> oh!
11:43 < rxr> only popt fails 
11:43 < rxr> but it is not needed
11:43 < rxr> I leave that for now ...
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11:45 < rxr> jeru: you do not actually have a 2.4 kernel box with isapnp card standing around ?
11:45 < jeru> rxr: no ... sorry 
11:45 < rxr> too bad
11:46 -!- codetux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
11:49 < rxr> jeru: I need some place to install the embutils on every system
11:49 < rxr> for use in the nwe initrd
11:49 < rxr> /usr/embutils ?
11:50 < rxr> accompanying /usr/dietlibc ...
11:51 < jeru> rxr: hmm ... why not /opt/embutils ?
11:51 < rxr> because it looks so optional and still needed for the initrd
11:52 < rxr> also some people including me sometimes rm -rf /opt/* to regain needed hd space ...
11:53 < jeru> rxr: then we should use /usr/embutils ... I think ... but I'm not a LFS expert ;)
11:53 < jeru> what's included in the embutils package ?
11:54 < jeru> forget about the last question ;)
11:55 < rxr> hehe
11:56 < jeru> rxr: what could be the problem that binutils fails to build in stage 2 ?
11:56 < rxr> hm - what is the error ...
11:59 < jeru> oh ... moment ... there are different errors in the build log i.e.
11:59 < jeru> perl ../../../binutils/../etc/texi2pod.pl -Dman -Dwindres < ../../../binutils/doc/binutils.texi > windres.pod
11:59 < jeru> /bin/sh: perl: command not found
11:59 < rxr> looks like binutils now need perl ...
11:59 < jeru> yep
11:59 < rxr> but let's not disable it there ...
12:00 < rxr> let's get perl that early on
12:00 < rxr> jeru: btw. did you update binutils ?
12:00 < jeru> no! did you ?
12:00 < rxr> no
12:00 < jeru> cc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I../../gas -I. -D_GNU_SOURCE -I. -I../../gas -I../bfd -I../../gas/config -I../../gas/../include -I../../gas/.. -I../../gas/../bfd -I../../gas/../intl -I../intl -DLOCALEDIR="\"/usr/share/locale\""   -W -Wall -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -g -O2  -c ../../gas/hash.c
12:00 < jeru> Broken pipe
12:00 < jeru> make[3]: *** [arparse.c] Error 1
12:00 < jeru> make[3]: Leaving directory `/TOOLCHAIN/src.binutils.1117543338.27377.0/binutils-2.15.94.0.2.2/objdir/binutils
12:01 < rxr> maybe texinfo update then ...
12:01 < rxr> hm
12:01 < jeru> yes ... but I downgraded to texinfo 4.7. on the ref build 
12:02 < jeru> perl is the main problem I guess
12:04 < jeru> rxr: btw, I started a generic embedded build too, but minit failed again 
12:04 < rxr> ok - I enable and fix it for stage1
12:04 < rxr> then it must be some arch problem
12:04 < jeru> do you use sth. "special" you've not commited yet
12:04 < rxr> for ARM it built here - minutes ago
12:04 < jeru> rxr: do we build minit with uclibc ?
12:06 < rxr> in embedded, yes
12:06 < jeru> i586-t2-linux-uclibc-gcc -Wall -W -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -Os -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -o hard-reboot hard
12:06 < jeru> -reboot.c -lowfat
12:06 < jeru> minit.c:19:17: fmt.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < jeru> minit.c:20:17: str.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < jeru> minit.c: In function `loadservice':
12:06 < jeru> minit.c:149: warning: implicit declaration of function `str_len'
12:06 < jeru> minit.c: In function `main':
12:06 < jeru> minit.c:540: warning: implicit declaration of function `fmt_ulong'
12:06 < jeru> msvc.c:8:17: str.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < jeru> msvc.c:9:17: fmt.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < jeru> msvc.c:10:20: buffer.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < jeru> msvc.c:13:20: errmsg.h: No such file or directory
12:06 < rxr> we build minit with the system lib c
12:06 < rxr> libowfat maybe ?
12:07 < jeru> and you commited the changes of the embedded target yet ?
12:09 < jeru> ok ... I've done a svn up ... and try again
12:13 < jeru> rxr: btw, the actual err log of binutils is available there -> http://t2.geeks.cl/regressions/jeru/trunkref/regressions.html
12:21 < rxr> Microsoft auch 2005 auf dem LinuxTag in Karlsruhe
12:22 < jeru> rxr: I guess they will send some patent lawyers 
12:27  * jeru out for lunch now
12:27 < rxr> xu
12:27 < rxr> cu even
12:30 < rxr> debug-perl:[perl-5.8.6]# file perl
12:30 < rxr> perl: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, ARM, version 1 (ARM), for GNU/Linux 2.0.0, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), stripped
12:34 -!- madtux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has joined #t2
12:34 < madtux> re
12:34 < rxr> wb
12:34 < madtux> danke
12:48 < jeru> re 
12:51 < jeru> rxr: btw, how are the chances to get a embedded dietlibc based target ?
12:52 < rxr> the former psion was dietlibc
12:52 < jeru> rxr: and why do you changed it to use uclibc ?
12:52 < rxr> however you can only build up minimal stuff with it - due to the lack of sophisticated dynamic libraries (x86) or the existence of those (anything all) all complex stuff does not build
12:53 < rxr> including iptables since it wants loadable objects ...
12:53 < jeru> ic
12:53 < jeru> rxr: irda-utils also failing on my generic embedded build
12:53 < rxr> however I want a config option in embedded to select full-featured (=>uclibc) or tiny (=>dietlibc)
12:54 < jeru> will be back shortly 
12:56 < valentin> moin
12:56 < rxr> moin valentin 
13:06 < jeru> hi valentin
13:07 < jeru> rxr: minit still failing 
13:07 < rxr> what error?
13:07 < jeru> sam as before
13:07 < jeru> same
13:08 < jeru> libowfat was build correctly before minit
13:09 -!- jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has quit [Excess Flood]
13:09 -!- jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has joined #t2
13:09 < CIA-9> lars * r9269 /branches/2.1/package/network/neon/neon.conf: 
13:09 < CIA-9> * Added configure option --with-ssl. Thus in subversion https
13:09 < CIA-9>  repository access is enabled.
13:16 < CIA-9> lars * r9270 /trunk/package/network/neon/neon.conf: 
13:16 < CIA-9> * merged 9269 from 2.1: Added configure option --with-ssl to neon.
13:16 < CIA-9>  Thus in subversion https repository access is enabled.
14:23 < rxr> Intel Preps Mac Mini Look-Alike  
14:23 < rxr> http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,67664,00.html?tw=rss.TEK
14:24 < jsaw> re
14:25 < jeru> hi jsaw ... how are you ?
14:25 < jsaw> rxr: you may add "IBM ThinkPad R31" to the live-cd certified list
14:25 < jsaw> jeru: catched a cold but otherwise fine, thanks, and you?
14:25 < valentin> hi jsaw
14:26 < rxr> jsaw: hi and ok
14:26 < jsaw> hi :)
14:27 < jeru> jsaw: thanks ... I'm allmost fine ...same procedure as every day ;)
14:29 < jsaw> hehe
14:31 -!- madtux [~mike@65.182.14.29] has quit ["Leaving"]
14:38 < rxr> == 05/31/05 14:33:55 =[1]=> Finished building package perl.
14:38 < rxr> - puh - finally
14:39 < jeru> rxr: that looks quite good :)
14:39 < CIA-9> rene * r9271 /trunk/package/base/uclibc/patches/perl-10-fileno.patch: * fixed the uclibc perl-10-fileno.patch, to not mangle glibc builds
14:40 < rxr> damn - but the flist is wrong
14:40 < rxr> all stuff prefix with $root ...
14:41 < rxr> so - should have been trivial - next test build
14:54 < CIA-9> rene * r9272 /trunk/package/perl/perl/ (perl.conf perl.desc): 
14:54 < CIA-9> * added perl to stage 1 and fixed it to cross build (so far tested
14:54 < CIA-9>  with the embedded target and uclibc / arm)
14:55 < CIA-9> rene * r9273 /trunk/target/embedded/config.in: * added perl to the embedded target - now that it cross builds
15:05 < jsaw> cu later
15:06 < jeru> cu jsaw 
15:06 < rxr> cu jsaw 
15:23 < CIA-9> chris * r9274 /trunk/package/base/syslog-ng/head_n.patch: * added a patch for correcting the 'head' syntax in the configure scripts
15:47 < rxr> valentin: alife?
15:51 < sparc-kly[u5]> hi all
15:51 < jeru> hi sparc-kly[u5] 
15:55 < valentin> rxr: a bit
15:56 < rxr> ouhm - that does not sound good ...
15:56 < valentin> is it important ?
15:56 < rxr> nope
15:57 < valentin> ok, then i return to the kitchen
15:58 < sparc-kly[u5]>  09:38:25 up 12 days, 15:15,  1 user,  load average: 0.28, 0.14, 0.05
15:59 < sparc-kly[u5]> i love my stable U5 
16:09 < keinek> morning
16:09 < keinek> :)
16:10 < jeru> hi keine
16:10 < jeru> keinek: 
16:17 < CIA-9> chris * r9275 /trunk/package/security/libpreludedb/libpreludedb.desc: * updated libpreludedb (0.9.0-rc5 -> 0.9.0-rc7)
16:17 < rxr> jeru: did popt built in your embedded build ?
16:18 < jeru> rxr: no
16:18 < CIA-9> chris * r9276 /trunk/package/security/libpreludedb/libpreludedb.desc: * added forgotten checksum
16:18 < jeru> rxr: I've disabled popt for now
16:20 < jeru> rxr: but arptables, ebtables, libol (but unfortunatly not syslog-ng) building on a embedded target
16:20 < rxr> jeru: misc/archive/Update does the patching, download _and_ checksum injection ...
16:20 < rxr> does syslog-ng look too broken =
16:20 < rxr> ? even
16:21 < jeru> no ... it can't find a proper libol
16:21 < jeru> looks like a ld problem ...
16:21 < jeru> does ld works different in a cross build ?
16:22 < rxr> well - i386-t2-linux-uclibc-ld does work ...
16:22 < rxr> not ld ... as it is the system one ...
16:26 < jeru> rxr: but these are not my most important issues atm ... having a functional minit would be nice ... but I don't know how I could solve the problem. I think I've to take some "debugging lessons" from you 
16:26 < rxr> == 05/31/05 16:25:10 =[1]=> Finished building package minit.
16:26 < rxr> == 05/31/05 16:25:27 =[1]=> Finished building package fgetty.
16:26 < jeru> x86 ?
16:27 < rxr> hm - the only thing failing is libpopt
16:27 < rxr> yes
16:27 < rxr> before I tested arm
16:27 < jeru> then what's wrong with my build ?
16:27 < rxr> .o(no idea)
16:29 < jeru> rxr: ok ... I'll try to build it again
16:30 < jeru> rxr: do I've to check a special option while configuring the target ?
16:31 < rxr> nope - I rm -rf'ed mine to be sure
16:31 < jeru> ok
16:31 < rxr> guess it is some other latent bug hiding somewhere not affecting builds on mine - but on your box ...
16:32 < jeru> minit still fails :/
16:33 < jeru> rxr: take a look ->
16:33 < jeru> i386-t2-linux-uclibc-gcc -Wall -W -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -Os -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -c msvc.c
16:33 < jeru> i386-t2-linux-uclibc-gcc -Wall -W -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -Os -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -o pidfilehack pidf
16:33 < jeru> ilehack.c
16:33 < jeru> minit.c:19:17: fmt.h: No such file or directory
16:33 < jeru> minit.c:20:17: str.h: No such file or directory
16:33 < jeru> the strange thing is, that msvc failed before ... but now it builds
16:34 < jeru> parallell issue ?
16:34 < rxr> build/embedded-2.2.0-alpha-x86-embedded/usr/include/libowfat/fmt.h
16:34 < rxr> hm
16:34 < rxr> no - don't think so
16:34 < jeru> but minit.c was compiled on my last run, but not on that before
16:34 < jeru> wasn't
16:35 < rxr> well - try it ...
16:35 < jeru> arrg
16:35 < rxr> cd src.minit...
16:35 < rxr> or - well - just flag it NOPARALLEL and try again
16:35 < jeru> ok ... first trying to flag it 
16:36 < jeru> nope ... NOPARALLEL has no effect
16:37 < jeru> rxr: what do you want me to try before ?
16:37 < jeru> cd src.minit...
16:38 < jeru> error-log from the last build ->
16:38 < jeru> i386-t2-linux-uclibc-gcc -Wall -W -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -Os -O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -c minit.c
16:38 < jeru> minit.c:19:17: fmt.h: No such file or directory
16:38 < jeru> minit.c:20:17: str.h: No such file or directory
16:38 < jeru> minit.c: In function `loadservice':
16:38 < jeru> minit.c:149: warning: implicit declaration of function `str_len'
16:38 < jeru> minit.c: In function `main':
16:38 < jeru> minit.c:540: warning: implicit declaration of function `fmt_ulong'
16:38 < jeru> minit.c:521: warning: 'idx' might be used uninitialized in this function
16:38 < jeru> make: *** [minit.o] Error 1
16:41 < jeru> rxr: I guess I've found the problem 
16:42 < rxr> are the headers take from the host system ?
16:42 < jeru> right
16:42 < jeru> I installed libowfat on the host I build on 
16:42 < jeru> but that's not the right behavior I guess ...
16:43 < jeru> damn ... now it builds
16:44 < jeru> rxr: btw, why you don't use pkgprefix in minit.conf for the includes of libowfat ?
16:45 < rxr> guess because it was written long before pkgprefix
16:45 < rxr> jeru: ok - I fix it to build without host headers ,-)
16:45 < jeru> ah ... ok ... :)
16:45 < jeru> thank you :)
16:47 < jeru> rxr: you cannot imagine how lucky I am, that minit is building now :)
17:04 < rxr> I think I focus on two kind of systems
17:05 < rxr> very modern, easy to use desktop system - with live presentation and installation and very small scale embedded appliances / servers
17:06 < valentin> cu later
17:07 < rxr> cu
17:07 < jeru> cu valentin 
17:14 < jeru> rxr: what are your common steps for getting a package cross compile ?
17:15 < rxr> well - the are several aspects involved
17:15 < rxr> I could write an overview some time ...
17:15 < jeru> if the configure scripts support  ./configure --host=target_arch ... should test it first ?
17:16 < rxr> test ?
17:20 < jeru> vlan package builds on embedded too
17:21 < jeru> but that's no surprise anyway ...
17:22 < CIA-9> rene * r9277 /trunk/package/base/minit/minit.conf: 
17:22 < CIA-9> * fixed minit to use the sandbox libowfat headers, not the build
17:22 < CIA-9>  host ones
17:46 < jeru> rxr: btw, if I discover packages that we can cross build should I add the CROSS flag for it ?
17:47 < rxr> we have a CROSS flag ?
17:47 < jeru> I thought so ... or am I worng ?
17:47 < jeru> wrong
17:48 < rxr> well, ...
17:48 < jeru> if you don't know ... ??? ;)
17:48 < rxr> I think we have none ,-)
17:48 < rxr> KDE 3.4.1
17:50 < rxr> Fertigstellung von Debian Sarge verz?gert sich erneut
17:50 < rxr> Transmeta verkauft Crusoe-Produktlinie an chinesisches Unternehmen
17:50 < jeru> cross compiling gmp seems to work out of the box too
17:51 < rxr> best check the flist
17:51 < jeru> rxr: they should rename "Sarge" to "Sarg" ;)
17:51 < rxr> for defect / brain dead rock inherited .conf files you might get $your-t2-location/build/.../$configid-again/...
17:54 < jeru> rxr: have you seen sth. like that before ... ?
17:54 < jeru> i386-t2-linux-uclibc-ar: illegal option -- w
18:02 < rxr> again microsoft windows commericla ...
18:02 < rxr> grummel ...
18:02 < rxr> and how M$ get on my nerves while star trek ng ...
18:02 < rxr> damn company ..?
18:20 < jeru> rxr: have succesfully build openssl using uclibc yet ?
18:22 < CIA-9> chris * r9278 /trunk/package/network/stunnel/stunnel.desc: 
18:22 < CIA-9> * updated stunnel (4.09 -> 4.10)
18:22 < CIA-9> * changed [M] flag
18:25 -!- mtr [~Michael@p54AF84EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #t2
18:28 < rxr> IIRC there was some problem cross compiling openssl ...
18:28 < rxr> at least openssh's configure was totally f*cked up
18:36 < CIA-9> rene * r9279 /trunk/package/shells/dash/dash.desc: * updated dash (0.5.2-1 -> 0.5.2-5)
18:37 < rxr> hm - so far I had only one segfault on the U5
18:37 < rxr> that was ld during 5-glibc - the rest - including xorg built so far ...
18:37 -!- mtr_ [~Michael@p54AF9472.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:37 < rxr> in 64 bit land ...
18:42 < rxr> r8835 | ragnar | 2005-05-12 20:21:19 +0200 (Thu, 12 May 2005) | 2 lines
18:42 < rxr> * popt needs -lintl for uclibc systems
18:42 < rxr> ^- not for me and you jeru 
18:43 < jeru> rxr: not or note ? ;)
18:43 < rxr> not
18:44 < CIA-9> rene * r9280 /trunk/package/base/uclibc/patches/popt-uclibc.patch: 
18:44 < CIA-9> * removed uclibc popt patch - not needed and harmful - library
18:44 < CIA-9>  not available
18:44 < rxr> == 05/31/05 18:43:47 =[1]=> Finished building package popt.
18:44 < jeru> rxr: nice 
18:45 < rxr> so - embedded target regressions resolved ,-)
18:45  * jeru moving home now ... 
18:46 < jeru> rxr: if you want to have more stuff that don't compile on it, I can deliver some more ;)
18:46 < rxr> no - thanks
18:46 < rxr> but you could add all the stuff that builds to the package list ...
18:46 < jeru> haha :)
18:47 < rxr> why haha ... ?
18:48 < jeru> rxr: .oO( just some evil thoughts )o
18:48 < jeru> rxr: .oO( placing some broken packages into the list )o 
18:49  * jeru hides
18:49 < jeru> bye bye ... cu later
18:51 < jeru> unfortunately some important packages for my security box don't build with uclibc yet .. so I think I've to use glibc for getting it working atm.
18:52 -!- jeru [~jeru@mail.oberlinhaus.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
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19:02 < mnemoc> hi
19:02 < madtux> yar
19:03 < rxr> hey mnemoc 
19:03 < mnemoc> hi madtux 
19:03 < mnemoc> hi rxr 
19:05 < mnemoc> outch... 183 commits to review o_O
19:22 < CIA-9> amery * r9281 /branches/2.1/package/x11/ (wmint/prefix.patch wmint/wmint.conf xli/gcc34.patch): * merged 9236,9237 from trunk: fixed wmint and xli
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19:27 < rxr> mnemoc: should I help you with merging - e.g. merge the obvious ones I do myself - do you want to keep a bigger picture of 2.1 ... ?
19:28 < mnemoc> rxr: do your merge requests ;)
19:28 -!- sparc-kly[u5] [~mubex@66-50-123-218.prtc.net] has joined #t2
19:29 < mnemoc> rxr: can you add tipical browser plugins to mozilla/firefox/other ? flash, shockwave, java?
19:30 < rxr> ?
19:30 < rxr> do you want to know if it is possible - or if I want to package them ?
19:31 < mnemoc> the later
19:32 < rxr> ouhm - why do you ask me?
19:32 < mnemoc> desktop/livecd maintainer :)
19:32 < rxr> haven't I already made clear with many postings, how much I hate binary only software crap ?
19:33 < rxr> I convince people for an open desktop - not to throw backdor, worms, trojan, malicus whatever bianry crap onto some tiny lonely CPU ...
19:33 -!- _Lewellyn [syllabiz@lewellyn.silver.supporter.pdpc] has joined #t2
19:33 < rxr> I fear you need someone else to package those ...
19:33 < mnemoc> these days a browser withouth those plugins is kind of useless... and thinking in livecd i wondered about packaging them
19:33 < mnemoc> at least flash
19:33 < rxr> well - we are not even allowed to include e.g. the shockwave or sun java stuff on the livecd, correct?
19:34 < _Lewellyn> rxr: how's the livecd coming?
19:34 < rxr> mnemoc: I never needed flash in my life ...
19:34 < rxr> _Lewellyn: oh - not much work on in the last days - just the discussion righ now ... ,-)
19:34 < _Lewellyn> rxr: i've been to bank websites where the login area is in flash... "for your security" :(
19:34 < mnemoc> you are not a 'normal desktop user'
19:34 < rxr> but I'll do a few more bits over the next days
19:34 < rxr> _Lewellyn: oh my god
19:34 < rxr> mnemoc: not ?
19:35 < _Lewellyn> rxr: ok. i'm going to try burning it again. got a fresh stack of cd-rs and a fresh stack of cd-rws.
19:35 < _Lewellyn> and i'm stubborn :)
19:35 < rxr> mnemoc: ah - yes - on Mac OS X I always wonder about the smoothly anamiated flash commercials on news sites *g*
19:35 < rxr> and thank god I have not to endure them on Linux ...
19:36 < _Lewellyn> rxr: you can also avoid the crap people WANT to see in flash, too...
19:36 < rxr> but this should not hinder you or someone else to add packages for those ..
19:36 < _Lewellyn> like newgrounds.com :(
19:36 < mnemoc> rxr: non-geek people visit lot of flash-dependent sites
19:36 < rxr> there are flash sites?
19:36 < rxr> I tought HTML and CSS are the languages of the web ...
19:36 < _Lewellyn> as much as i hate to admint it, mnemoc is right there
19:37 < _Lewellyn> rxr: i can show you plenty of legitimate corporate sites which require flash :(
19:37 < _Lewellyn> especially for hollywood movies
19:37 -!- dualopteron [~dualopter@Dardeene-68.188.44.193.charter-stl.com] has quit [Client Quit]
19:37 -!- dualopteron [~dualopter@Dardeene-68.188.44.193.charter-stl.com] has joined #t2
19:38 < rxr> as long as there is no flash version that runs on my SPARC, PowerPC and ARM, and that is open source it can not be a reasonable language / binary format to support ...
19:38 < mnemoc> last-generation web designers are trained to use that crap, and they love it
19:38 < mnemoc> the format is open
19:38 < rxr> oh - those sites that contain of a big fat KDE Hex editor embedded in the konqueror for mime x/shockwave whatever? *g*
19:38 < rxr> I always wonder who should interprete this matrix like content ,-)
19:38 < mnemoc> even php can render SWF files ;)     but you need a plugin to display it
19:38 < _Lewellyn> i believe that someone is working on an oss plugin.
19:39 < rxr> tought they are the ultimative geek sites ,-)
19:39  * _Lewellyn wonders the status of it
19:39 < mnemoc> http://gplflash.sourceforge.net/
19:39 < mnemoc> http://swift-tools.net/Flash/
19:40 < _Lewellyn> do they have useable plugins yet?
19:40 < mnemoc> we are packaging manual:// stuff
19:40 < mnemoc> even non-distributable firmwares
19:41 < rxr> mnemoc: I did not say it has not to be packaged - I just said I'll not do it
19:41 < rxr> regarding the intel firmware - if you mean it - I take the consequences if there will be any ...
19:41 < mnemoc> rxr: i understand that
19:42 < rxr> but I can try the gpl flash ...
19:42 < mnemoc> rxr: i'm just giving feedback to livecd maintainer
19:42 < rxr> mnemoc: even if I would package it - or add it to the CD - macromedia does not allow distribution, do they ?
19:42 < mnemoc> rxr: i tried in with 3 users yestarday, all 'failing' due to flash and java plugins on their 'mandatory sites'
19:42 < _Lewellyn> rxr: the aforementioned newgrounds.com is a good testbed for flash support
19:42 < _Lewellyn> and macromedia does aloow distribution
19:43 < _Lewellyn> the terms are quite liberal
19:43 < _Lewellyn> even the use of their logo is easy to obtain
19:44 < rxr> mnemoc: ouhm
19:45 < rxr> mnemoc: why are so many people in your country using this crap?
19:45 < rxr> mnemoc: aren't you suppost to use less expensive US financing stuff ?
19:47  * rxr getting fresh coffee
19:47 < mnemoc> rxr: recient web designers are been trained to use flash as their _almost unique_ editing too
19:48 < mnemoc> rxr: only freaks are we and CMSs really use html/css
19:49 < mnemoc> s/are/as/
19:50 < _Ragnar__> flash yukk
19:50 < _Lewellyn> at least we're all in agreement :)
19:50 < mnemoc> :)
19:50 < madtux> flash is attractive to non-geek people
19:51 < madtux> for some people heavy animations are what matters
19:51 < mnemoc> and we want to be atractive to that people
19:51 < madtux> i am not a fan of flash myself, but it does generate some money for me
19:52 < mnemoc> madtux: have you done flash animations yourself?
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19:52 < madtux> to be attractive to that people we would have to either offer an alternative equivalent to it, or a tool to edit/create flash animations on free software enviroments
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19:53 -!- jeru [~jeru@p54BFF703.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
19:53 < madtux> mnemoc, i have project called "strip poker" which is actually based in flash + cold fusion
19:53 < jeru> re hi
19:53 < madtux> don't blame me for that i took partnership on it when the project had already started
19:53 < madtux> wb jeru 
19:53 < jeru> hi madtux 
19:54 < mnemoc> madtux: :)
19:54 < madtux> what?
19:54 < madtux> at least i am honest
19:54 < madtux> :)
19:55 < mnemoc> http://www.nongnu.org/gcjwebplugin/
19:55 < mnemoc> madtux: at least you? what are you trying to say?
19:55 < madtux> and if that gives me enough money to buy me new toys that will help me work on FS bases stuff then thats fine for me
19:55 < jeru> hi mnemoc
19:55 < madtux> nothing really... u figured those words would intrigue you
19:55 < madtux> :)
19:56 < mnemoc> hi jeru 
19:56 < mnemoc> madtux: uhm
19:58 < madtux> mm.... the warning in the very beggining scares me a little bit
19:58 < madtux> but looks cool
20:00 < mnemoc> MS Outlook should have a similar warning :)
20:00 < mnemoc> "at least they are honest"
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20:03 < _Lewellyn> fwiw
20:03 < _Lewellyn>    Linkname: Macromedia - Support : Macromedia Player Licensing : Software Developers            
20:03 < madtux> i like honesty
20:03 < madtux> :)
20:03 < _Lewellyn>         URL: http://www.macromedia.com/support/shockwave/info/licensing/main_2.html              
20:04 < mnemoc> madtux: :)
20:09 < rxr> re
20:11 < jeru> wb rxr 
20:20 < _Lewellyn> rxr: did you get coffee for all of us?
20:43 -!- maddin [~martin@p54BDFFD0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
20:44 < maddin> hi
20:45 < mnemoc> hi maddin 
20:57 -!- keinek [~Keinek@201.254.10.51] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
21:13 < maddin> hi mnemoc 
21:20 < CIA-9> amery * r9282 /branches/2.1/package/database/dbf/ (. dbf.conf dbf.conf dbf.desc dbf.desc): * merged 8539 from trunk: added dbf (0.8.3.1)
21:22 < rxr> re
21:23 < madtux> yar
22:42 < valentin> re
22:52 < mnemoc> yuck.... i just received four vote to participate on july's italian referendum   which made me happy. then i openned the newspaper randomly and i saw Pope calling catholic people to not participate on the referendum :|
22:53 < _Lewellyn> what's the referendum regarding?
22:53 < mnemoc> assisted reproduction
22:53 < _Lewellyn> ah
22:53 < SerWou> hello guys
22:53 < mnemoc> hi SerWou 
22:53 < _Lewellyn> hoi SerWou 
22:54 < SerWou> sup mnemoc ?
22:54 < mnemoc> == 05/31/05 17:02:31 =[5]=> Finished building package bdb-java.
22:54 < SerWou> hello _Lewellyn 
22:57 < valentin> mnemoc: why does he say not to participate ?
22:58 < valentin> i mean, he could easily say "vote against"
22:58 < valentin> this would be more effective ..
22:58 < mnemoc> valentin: he said you can't vote about life
22:58 < mnemoc> valentin: he wants to void the voting
22:59 < valentin> he has not understood the meaning of democracy
22:59 < mnemoc> yes
22:59 < valentin> but why should he, he is a bavarian
22:59 < mnemoc> :D
22:59 < valentin> here in germany we hate bavarians ,)
22:59 < mnemoc> i know :)
23:00 < mnemoc> voting against is highly more effective
23:00 < valentin> yep
23:02 < valentin> maybe he vants assisted reproduction but is afraid to say so :)
23:02 < valentin> wants even
23:04 < CIA-9> chris * r9283 /trunk/package/security/strongswan/ (. strongswan.conf strongswan.desc): (log message trimmed)
23:04 < CIA-9> * added strongswan package (2.4.2)
23:04 < CIA-9> * Note:
23:04 < CIA-9>  The Strongswan IPSEC implementation supports both, Linux 2.4 and 2.6 kernels.
23:04 < CIA-9>  The initial version of the package doesn't support automagically patched
23:04 < CIA-9>  kernels like some other T2 packages, but this will be changed soon ;)
23:04 < CIA-9>  If you want to use it with a 2.4 kernel you've to patch your kernel!
23:04 < valentin> i mean, with a.r. humanity can live without sex, which is said to be evil...
23:05 < jeru> good night folks 
23:05 < _Lewellyn> valentin: unless you read the bible literally ;)
23:05 -!- jeru [~jeru@p54BFF703.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
23:05 < _Lewellyn> sleep well jeru
23:05 < _Lewellyn> bah
23:08 < mnemoc> valentin: :)
23:12 < valentin> bah what ?
23:13 < _Lewellyn> i hate when people quit as i'm wishing them well ;)
23:14 < valentin> _Lewellyn: i did not find much evidence in the bible that sexuality is a bad thing (as long as you don't do it with another person's wife...)
23:14 < _Lewellyn> that was my point. ask me later and i'll point you at plenty of pro-sex parts of the bible.
23:16 < valentin> yeah - there are even very juicy parts like lot's daughters doing it with their father and so on...
23:17 < _Lewellyn>  http://www.siecus.org/religion/reli0001.html
23:17 < _Lewellyn> interesting read :)
23:18 < mnemoc> valentin: no-sex thing is because being a prist is a 'full-time' job and his family is the 'church' and not a wife and children
23:18 < valentin> mnemoc: yes i understand that, but many religios fanatics saying everybody should be abstinent
23:19 < mnemoc> valentin: stupid religious fanatics
23:19 < valentin> btw, there is a part in the bible wich says that every priest _must have_ a family
23:19 < mnemoc> valentin: where?
23:19 < valentin> mnemoc: they say, we're the stupid ones
23:20 < valentin> mnemoc: dunno from hand
23:20 < valentin> i wondered when i stumbled over it, because there is another text saying the opposite
23:20 < valentin> but that is the case for so many things
23:20 < mnemoc> valentin: celibate is a philosophical concept imposed by.... saint paul
23:21 < mnemoc> valentin: which means, post biblical
23:21 < valentin> yep
23:21 < valentin> t
23:22 < valentin> the whole catholic church is a post biblical org :)
23:22 < mnemoc> some doctrines are biblical, some post biblical :)
23:23 < valentin> however, i dislike doctrines
23:24 < mnemoc> but invalidating just because something is post-biblical or written in greek instead of aramean is dumb
23:24 < mnemoc> valentin: :)
23:24 < valentin> but this does not mean i have no ethical values
23:25 < mnemoc> valentin: of course
23:25 < valentin> i just do not like anything which tends towards totalitarian
23:25 < mnemoc> :)
23:25 < mnemoc> as far as they are not imposed, they are not totalitarian
23:26 < valentin> yes, as far as they are not imposed...
23:27 < valentin> mnemoc, will you vote or follow the pope ?
23:27 < valentin> (you do not need to answer if you do not want to)
23:27 < mnemoc> i want they to keep current law
23:28 < mnemoc> but i'm not sure if voting yes means 'keep' or 'remove' :\
23:30 < valentin> .oO
23:31 < mnemoc> the vote say: "the article n.$foo says'....'"   [YES] [NO]
23:32 < mnemoc> what 'yes' means?? :\
23:32 < mnemoc> yes, it says that
23:32 < valentin> hm
23:32 < mnemoc> yes, it says that and i like it
23:32 < mnemoc> yes, it says that but i don't like it
23:32 < mnemoc> ...
23:33 < mnemoc> no, it says a different thinn you liers 
23:34 < _Lewellyn> mnemoc: that sounds like our ballots :(
23:34 < _Lewellyn> "Vote yes and screw people over."
23:34 < mnemoc> hehe
23:34 < _Lewellyn> "Vote no, and the law will be passed as a rider by the legislature."
23:34 < mnemoc> :D
23:35 < mnemoc> did you vote for terminator?
23:35 < _Lewellyn> hell no.
23:35 < CIA-9> amery * r9284 /branches/2.1/package/database/ (3 files in 2 dirs): * fixed bdb-java
23:35 < _Lewellyn> i voted against the recall, then i marked in gary coleman.
23:35 < _Lewellyn> he can use the money ;)
23:35 < mnemoc> :)
23:36 < valentin> mnemoc: titus 1,6 ff
23:37 < valentin> even 1,5-9
23:38 < valentin> f any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.  For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre ....
23:38 < mnemoc> titus? he is not in my bible O_O
23:38 < valentin> this is not the part i searched for, but...
23:39 < valentin> mnemoc: you got the pope version ? ,)
23:39 < valentin> it is even in the KJV
23:39 < mnemoc> not on the catholic :)
23:39 < valentin> http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/Tts/Tts001.html#top
23:40 < _Lewellyn> bible.gospelcom.net/bible should have it
23:40 < valentin> mnemoc: they know why they removed this chapter :)
23:41 < mnemoc> catholic cannon is older ;)
23:41 < mnemoc> you added it :p
23:41 < valentin> mnemoc: i have a version wich is not catholic, but accepted by the catholic church
23:42 < valentin> it is a common translation which catholic and german protestant church agreed on.
23:42 < mnemoc> http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14746b.htm <--- is this titus your titus?
23:43 < mnemoc> http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14727b.htm
23:44 < mnemoc> "Saints Timothy and Titus were two of the most beloved and trusted disciples of St. Paul, whom they accompanied in many of his journeys."
23:44 < valentin> the second one, yes
23:44 < valentin> not the emperor
23:45 < mnemoc> nothing with 't' on the spanish version of catholic encyclopedia :p
23:46 < _Lewellyn> http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=63&chapter=1&version=58
23:46 < _Lewellyn> is that is?
23:47 < _Lewellyn> is that is, even
23:47 < mnemoc> valentin: read the 'objections' on the second link
23:47 < _Lewellyn> wsf. my see isn't working
23:47 < valentin> yes
23:47 < _Lewellyn> but it started back up.
23:47 < _Lewellyn> odd.
23:47 < mnemoc> weird
23:47 < valentin> _Lewellyn: the text is the correct one
23:48 < valentin> Cuando te dejé en la isla de Creta, lo hice para que arreglaras lo que quedaba por arreglar y para que, en cada pueblo, nombraras ancianos de la iglesia, de acuerdo con lo que yo te encargué. 6 Un anciano[a] debe llevar una vida irreprochable.
23:48 < _Lewellyn> define correct :)
23:48 < valentin> i speak no word of spanish, but with a bit latin i can figure up some content :)
23:49 < mnemoc> :)
23:49 < valentin> to sad jsaw is not here, iirc he knows much about bible texts
23:49 < _Lewellyn> i was wondering whether it was "correct" as in "what it SHOULD say", or "correct" as in "what the Church says it should say" :)
23:50 < mnemoc> afaik they never change the content, object or approve the whole thing
23:50 < mnemoc> change the content is risky
23:51 < valentin> but you have much room for interpretation when translating the text
23:51 < _Lewellyn> i'm sure i've read cases where they've changed content. but i am quite possibly incorrect
23:51 < valentin> esp the old hebrew writings
23:51 < mnemoc> what they do on jerusalem (catholic official translation) is to a large amount of foonotes
23:51 < _Lewellyn> valentin: yes. :(
23:51 < mnemoc> add*
23:51 < mnemoc> footnotes*
23:52 < valentin> and what they all do is choose the subset of scriptures to publish in their books
23:52 < _Lewellyn> i liked "foonotes" better :)
23:52 < mnemoc> :)
23:52 < valentin> foonotes :D
23:53 < mnemoc> http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03274a.htm
23:53 < mnemoc> ^--- Canon of the (Catholic) New Testament
23:54 < valentin> the old testament was checksummed
23:54 < valentin> about one decade before christ or so
23:54 < valentin> lars is an ex-theologist
23:54 < valentin> he studied theology befor switching to CS
23:55 < valentin> he told me some things about the "evolution" of the texts
23:55 < mnemoc> torah, misna and talmud(x2)
23:55 < mnemoc> theology is fun :)
23:56 < valentin> exegesis is fun
23:56 < valentin> as long as you do not have to study it ...
23:57 < mnemoc> amateur exegesis is fun^2 :)
23:58 < mnemoc> but dan brown is fun also
--- Log closed Wed Jun 01 00:00:08 2005