--- Log opened Sat May 14 00:00:49 2005
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00:33 < mnemoc> hi ojh
00:33 < ojh> Hi :)
00:35 < ojh> I was reading the site for the FUSE project yesterday, it has a lot of very cool file system add-ons that can be used with it.
00:36 < mnemoc> yep, fuse was a great invention
00:39 < _Ragnar__> :)
00:40 < _Ragnar__> plugin to setup netfilter and routing through a fs-like interface would be kewl:)
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00:53 < ojh> _Ragnar__: What do you have in mind? Implement ACL's as some sort of file hierarchy?
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00:55 < CIA-10> amery * r8864 /branches/2.1/package/zope/ (55 files in 26 dirs):
00:55 < CIA-10> * renamed zope.conf.in to our standard zope-conf.in
00:55 < CIA-10> * cleaned zope-conf.in usage, most .conf are not needed.
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00:55 < _Ragnar__> echo "192.168.1.1 metric 1" > /netfs/routes/0.0.0.0/0
00:56 < _Ragnar__> cat /netfs/routes/target/10.10.10.10
00:57 < _Ragnar__> 192.168.1.1
00:57 < _Ragnar__> ;)
00:59 < ojh> _Ragnar__: Interesting.
01:00 < _Ragnar__> *g*
01:02 < valentin> i will go to bed now - cu and gn8
01:02 < mnemoc> gn8 valentin
01:03 < valentin> happy hacking mnemoc :)
01:04 < mnemoc> :)
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01:37 < CIA-10> amery * r8865 /trunk/package/zope/ (55 files in 26 dirs): * merged 8864 from 2.1: renamed zope.conf.in to zope-conf.in and cleaned it's usage.
01:41 < CIA-10> amery * r8866 /branches/2.1/package/base/linux26/linux26.desc: * merged 8850 from trunk: updated linux26 (2.6.11.8 -> 2.6.11.9)
01:44 < CIA-10> amery * r8867 /branches/2.1/package/x86/memtest86/memtest86.desc: * merged 8792 from trunk: updated memtest86 (1.51 -> 1.55)
01:46 < CIA-10> amery * r8868 /branches/2.1/package/x86/lilo/lilo.desc: * merged 8791 from trunk: updated lilo (22.6.1 -> 22.7)
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02:02 < CIA-10> amery * r8869 /trunk/package/zope/linguaplone/ (linguaplone.conf linguaplone.desc): * adapted linguaplone to our new zope-conf.in
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06:05 < CIA-10> amery * r8870 /trunk/package/java/java-dirtree/ (. java-conf.in java-dirtree.conf java-dirtree.desc): * added java-dirtree package just to own opt/java dirs, for now
06:13 < CIA-10> amery * r8871 /branches/2.1/package/base/sysfiles/rocknet.sh: * merged 8795 from trunk: fixed rocknet to display an error message if no config file exists
06:18 < CIA-10> amery * r8872 /branches/2.1/package/base/sysfiles/system.init: * merged 8719,8731 from trunk: made sure /dev/{pts,shm} are created before mounting them
06:27 < CIA-10> amery * r8873 /branches/2.1/package/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
06:27 < CIA-10> * merged 8812 from trunk: added hal init script, hal user and group and added them to REGISTER
06:27 < CIA-10> * merged 8813 from trunk: added dbus init script
06:49 < CIA-10> amery * r8874 /branches/2.1/ (94 files in 83 dirs): * merged 8815 from trunk: added .init to the known extensions of Create-CopyPatch and injected the updated copyright note into the .init files.
06:58 < mnemoc> rxr: is gzip officialy broken on trunk? i get crt.o not found on 1-gzip
06:59 < mnemoc> rxr: is this due to --{enable,disable}-shared change on gcc ?
07:05 < CIA-10> amery * r8875 /branches/2.1/misc/share/REGISTER: * added HAL registrations missinging in commit 8873
08:30 < rxr> re
08:30 < rxr> mnemoc: no idea - need to start a new build
08:32 < sepp> moin :)
08:32 < rxr> moin
08:35 < rxr> libDSP 5.0.2 (stable)
08:35 < rxr> ^- we should package that "for fun"W
08:36 < rxr> Subversion 1.2.0-rc4
08:36 < rxr> cdrdao & GCDMaster 1.2.0
08:52 < sepp> has cdrecord a progress bar? looks like frozen
09:00 < sepp> i reboot to test the live cd
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09:42 < sepp> live cd works with one of 3 monitors :)
09:45 < sepp> with the sony tft connected it starts x with 85Hz instead of 75
09:47 < sepp> libgtk-x11 is missing - i wanted to start gimp
09:57 < sepp> with 2 monitors connected the tft turns out (out of sync warning) and the crt displays a purple/green blinking bg
10:42 < rxr> re
10:43 < rxr> hm
10:43 < rxr> sepp: can you try if your LCD works, if you remove this lines from /tmp/xorg.conf
10:43 < rxr> HorizSync 24.0 - 130.0
10:43 < rxr> VertRefresh 50-80
10:44 < rxr> and restart X?
10:45 < sepp> what is the root pass?
10:49 < rxr> no root login by default
10:49 < rxr> login as live
10:49 < rxr> no passwd by default
10:49 < rxr> sudo bash --login
10:49 < rxr> or set a root passwd if you feel to
10:49 < sepp> ahh ok i will test it
10:49 < sepp> brb
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10:59 < rxr> re
10:59 < rxr> so - finally - software RAID mounted on the udev only test system ,-)
11:02 < rxr> so - sound working ,-)
11:05 < valentin> moin
11:08 < rxr> moin
11:08 < rxr> valentin: my athlon is now on u/dev - booted the a trunk mkinitrd cretae early userspace ,-)
11:08 < valentin> oh
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11:17 < sepp> uhm only way to start x on this sony tft is to change the values in xorg.conf
11:17 < rxr> is remove enough?
11:17 < sepp> if i comment horiz/vert out it starts at 640x480
11:18 < sepp> only mode that x found
11:18 < sepp> all other xorg tests returned out of sync
11:19 < rxr> hm - you have nothin in the log regarding DDC ?
11:20 < rxr> monitor supports this and that moeds ?
11:20 < rxr> modes even ?
11:21 < sepp> i get lots of Not using default mode ... (hsync out of range)
11:22 < sepp> and at the end off all tests it set the only mode to "640x480": 25.2 MHz, 31.5 kHz, 60.0 Hz
11:24 < rxr> hm
11:25 < sepp> with the nvidia driver its even worse
11:27 < rxr> so your panel is not returning any DCC data I guess ... ?
11:27 < sepp> it returns wrong values
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11:32 < rxr> http://software.newsforge.com/artic
11:32 < rxr> sepp: okok ...
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11:32 < rxr> sepp: what options would you need to pass via the boot loader?
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11:32 < rxr> like modes="1024x768@60" or so ?
11:32 < sepp> yes
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11:33 < sepp> lol
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11:34 < sepp> cia attack
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11:35 < rxr> ?
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11:45 < rxr> .oO
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11:52 < rxr> ...
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11:53 < rxr> ... ...
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11:55 < rxr> valentin: do you think it is reasonable to send a End Of Life notifcation for ROCK Plug to the rock list ? pointing to hotplug++ ?
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11:55 < rxr> or do you think this will start a flamewar?
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12:01 < rxr> jeru: with u/dev the numbers for replugged usb-storage devices stay stable
12:01 < rxr> so as I assumed devfs bug
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12:17 < valentin> can anyone kickban CIA-10 ?
12:18 < rxr> hehe
12:20 < valentin> mnemoc: whatabout kgb ?
12:23 < rxr> mnemoc said when 2.1 is done
12:38 -!- live [~live@pD9E73DE6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
12:39 < live> hello
12:39 < rxr> hi
12:39 < live> hi rxr, I'm martin
12:40 < rxr> from the live cd ?
12:40 < live> yes
12:40 < rxr> and, all fine ?
12:40 < live> missing german keyboard layout :)
12:40 < live> live@localhost:~$ gimp
12:40 < live> gimp: error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
12:40 < rxr> hehe - yes, that will be done soon ...
12:40 < rxr> also known ,-)
12:41 < live> ok
12:41 < live> there is no root password, right?
12:41 < rxr> X comes up nicely and such ?
12:41 < rxr> live: nope ...
12:41 < rxr> but you can sudo bash --login
12:41 < rxr> or sudo passwd to set a root password
12:41 < rxr> live: what harware are you running ong ?
12:41 < rxr> on eve ...
12:41 < live> yes. there are binary nvidia drivers include?
12:42 < rxr> even ...
12:42 < rxr> yes - the nvidia binary driver should also be there ...
12:42 < rxr> but I do not enable it by default - due to the lack of testing ...
12:42 < rxr> if you want to enable it I can tell you how to ...
12:42 < rxr> live: can you post your hardare specs so I can add it to the tested hardware list ?
12:42 < live> yes please. i will test it
12:42 < rxr> live: ok - then do:
12:43 < rxr> sudo bash --login
12:43 < rxr> and then edit /tmp/xdetect
12:43 < rxr> e.g. with vi or whatever
12:43 < rxr> line 45 and 46 are nvidia driver detection
12:43 < rxr> they are commented out ...
12:44 < rxr> just remove the trailing hash and restart your X - and pray it comes up again ,-)
12:44 < rxr> but please
12:44 < rxr> write some lines about your hardware - cpu, ram, video card, vendor - if not selfmade
12:44 < live> okay, i will do it.
12:45 < live> back in some sec ...
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12:54 < rxr> seems the nvidia driver did not work out :-(((
12:54 -!- maddin [~martin@pD9E73DE6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #t2
12:54 < maddin> re
12:54 < rxr> hi
12:55 < maddin> okay, i have not change the root-password and yes, X is not restart Ö(
12:55 < rxr> I have feared that ...
12:55 < rxr> I'll investigate later why the binary dirver does not want to come up ..
12:55 < rxr> maddin: what are the specs of your hardware?
12:56 < maddin> It miss one kernel modul but found screens, but no useable configuration and then it found no screens ... foobar
12:56 < rxr> maddin: btw. in the next revision - the evening or so - the device permissions will be more correct, any volume will automatically appear - including plug-n-play USB and such storage devices and gimp will work
12:57 < rxr> soon it will have graphical network config - valentin is working on that
12:57 < maddin> now, kde is realy broken
12:57 < rxr> now ?
12:57 < valentin> maddin: what is broken in kde ?
12:57 < maddin> nothing is work. the kde-desktop is broken in the middle
12:57 < valentin> hi maddin btw
12:57 < maddin> hi valentin
12:57 < rxr> maddin: in the live cd or in your system ?
12:58 < maddin> at the live cd. I think the cd is broken
12:58 < maddin> the kde assistent start all minute
12:58 < maddin> btw: add a default kde-profile. so the kde-assitent will not start at first kde start?1
12:59 < rxr> no - because internation users will chooce the language there ...
12:59 < maddin> hmm, okay.
13:00 < rxr> maddin: hardware specs - hint hint
13:01 < maddin> one minute: I think, I muste reboot one time more
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13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: Call Trace:
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] class_device_attr_store+0x24/0x30
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] flush_write_buffer+0x28/0x30
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] sysfs_write_file+0x3b/0x60
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] vfs_write+0xfa/0x100
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] sys_write+0x3d/0x70
13:48 < rxr> May 14 13:45:27 haudraufinix kernel: [] syscall_call+0x7/0xb
13:48 < rxr> .oO
13:53 < valentin> rxr: what did you do ?
13:53 < rxr> tried to load by DVB-T PCI card's firmware with my new hotplug++ firmware loader ,-)
13:54 < valentin> yuck
13:54 < valentin> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/59553
13:55 < rxr> I would say leasson learned "never try to clean eletric devices in a washing machine" ...
13:57 < valentin> iBomb :)
13:58 < valentin> damn, if you search for (microsoft)? serial mouse (protocol\|detection) you get mainly noise
14:02 < mipe> does the livecd already have install to hd functionality?
14:06 < valentin> not realy
14:16 * sparc-kly now reboot for test T2 live :D
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14:18 < minto> hi all
14:19 < valentin> hi minto
14:19 < valentin> you do not know where to find a serial mouse protocol demo ?
14:19 < valentin> s/demo/docu
14:20 < minto> me? I am afraid I can't help you there.
14:21 < valentin> i should read some source code ... :(
14:21 < valentin> google sucks for that topic
14:28 < rxr> xorg:
14:28 < rxr> xc/programs/Xserver/hw/xfree86/input/mouse# vi pnp.c
14:29 < rxr> http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/resources/respec/specs/pnpcom.mspx
14:29 < rxr> maybe the later will even help your for modems
14:30 < valentin> thanx rxr
14:30 < rxr> I can plug my old modem into some box here if you wanna test it ,-)
14:30 < valentin> i tell you then...
14:30 < rxr> valentin: but better do network and the network article first ...
14:31 < rxr> we can do the not that common serial device detection early next week or so ...
14:31 < rxr> have you notified dr. that you could provide a network config article ?
14:31 < valentin> but i cannot test live cd when mouse does not work
14:32 < rxr> http://download.microsoft.com/download/1/6/1/161ba512-40e2-4cc9-843a-923143f3456c/pnpcom.rtf
14:32 < valentin> this guy is a doctor ?
14:32 < rxr> no - I just do not want to expose full names here ...
14:32 < valentin> ah
14:32 < valentin> overread that
14:32 < rxr> but dipl. ing. I think
14:33 < valentin> the "article idea" deadline was on thu
14:33 < valentin> i wrote a mail, maybe he wants it anyway
14:33 < valentin> but then i have to finish tomorow
14:34 < valentin> because they have an article deadline for 15.05
14:35 < valentin> so i have to "hack up" the user interface in the way it will look when all works ,)
14:35 < valentin> to take some screenshots
14:35 < rxr> yes, I know
14:35 < valentin> i think much can be done within 30h of work or so
14:36 < valentin> but if he does not want it, i do not care to much anyway
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16:00 -!- Topic for #t2: T2 | 2.1.0-beta4 RELEASED | The next generation of System Development Environments (SDE) | http://www.t2-project.org/
16:00 -!- Topic set by menomc [] [Sat Apr 16 00:33:34 2005]
16:00 [Users #t2]
16:00 [ _Ragnar__] [ maddin] [ mnemoc] [ rxr ] [ sparc-kly|U5]
16:00 [ CIA-10 ] [ minto ] [ mtr ] [ rxr_] [ valentin ]
16:00 [ jsaw ] [ mipe ] [ nzg ] [ sepp]
16:00 -!- Irssi: #t2: Total of 14 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 14 normal]
16:00 -!- Channel #t2 created Sun Aug 8 21:15:33 2004
16:00 -!- [freenode-info] help freenode weed out clonebots, please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
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17:45 < valentin> rxr: you can add kerstins machine to your cerified hardware section, too - if you want ...
17:46 < rxr> specs are?
17:46 < rxr> but the mouse does not yet work !
17:46 < rxr> ,-)
17:46 < rxr> Athlon 600 ?
17:46 < valentin> rxr: if i plug in an imaginary usb or (real) ps2 mouse, it would work out for sure
17:46 < valentin> yep
17:47 < rxr> MB RAM ?
17:47 < rxr> AMD Irongate board, right?
17:47 < rxr> which matrox? G450 or so ?
17:47 < valentin> there is 256 MB in it
17:48 < valentin> should be G450
17:48 < valentin> mom
17:48 < valentin> it is Irongate board
17:48 < rxr> dbus get's on my nerves ...
17:48 < valentin> Matrox Graphics, Inc. MGA G400 AGP (rev 130).
17:49 < valentin> G400 ??
17:49 -!- c4y0 [~cmora@adsl200-75-92-166.epm.net.co] has joined #t2
17:49 < c4y0> hi
17:49 < valentin> hi c4y0
17:49 < valentin> Trident Microsystems 4DWave NX (rev 2) <- though i did not test sound, the module was loaded
17:50 < rxr> I think we should start a certified Video and Sound round if it actually works out of the box ,-)
17:58 < rxr> damn - this hal stuff is quite complex ...
17:58 < rxr> I think it is mostly a quite misdesign...
17:58 < rxr> complex shity gnome style crap ...
17:59 < rxr> companies like red hat and novel produce ...
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18:00 < tilix> hi
18:00 < tilix> I`m writing this from T2 LiveCD r9!
18:00 < valentin> btw, stupid question: what exactly does PIM stand for ?
18:00 < valentin> hi tilix
18:01 < valentin> how does it work ?
18:03 < tilix> btw. there is something wrong with the PATH`s in this liveCD
18:03 < valentin> what is it ?
18:04 < tilix> i thought that modprobe is not on the cd, but I found it in /sbin
18:04 < tilix> you can`t run modprobe directly, you must run /sbin/modprobe
18:04 < valentin> tilix: as normal user or as root ?
18:04 < valentin> if you are user live, this is just normal
18:05 < tilix> but there is no root account, I think
18:05 < valentin> there is one - but without a login
18:05 < valentin> execute
18:05 < valentin> sudo /bin/bash --login
18:05 < valentin> then you get a rootshell
18:05 < valentin> and you can set a passwd
18:06 < tilix> netcardconfig from Knoppix works just fine here
18:06 < mnemoc_> what's nvidia status? keinek reported blank screen with r9 lastnight
18:06 < valentin> moin mnemoc_ !
18:06 < tilix> but the default cyrillic font is very ugly
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18:06 < valentin> hm - good that you say this
18:06 < mnemoc_> hi valentin, tilix
18:06 < tilix> hi mnemoc
18:06 < valentin> because you might be the only one who uses cyrillic :)
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18:09 < tilix> in order to test nvidia, will this work: modprobe nvidia, edit xorg.conf and then Ctrl-Alt-Backspace?
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18:10 < valentin> tilix: you have the nvidia module but it was not loaded ?
18:11 < tilix> rxr said he commented it out in xdetect
18:11 < tilix> and lsmod | grep nvidia gives only nvidia_agp
18:17 < rxr> tilix: yes, that could work, could you test ?
18:17 < tilix> sure
18:19 < tilix> bash-3.00$ sudo /sbin/modprobe nvidia
18:19 < tilix> FATAL: Error inserting nvidia (/lib/modules/2.6.11.8-dist/video/nvidia.ko): No such device
18:20 < tilix> dmesg:
18:20 < tilix> NVRM: no devices probed, aborting! NVRM: this often occurs when rivafb is loaded and claims the device's resources. NVRM: try removing the rivafb module (or reconfiguring your kernel to remove NVRM: rivafb support) and then try loading the NVIDIA kernel module again. NVRM: the NVIDIA probe routine was not called for 1 device(s)!!
18:21 < tilix> ok. it worked now
18:21 < rxr> is the rivafb loaded ?
18:21 < tilix> i`ve removed it
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18:22 < tilix> glxinfo: direct rendering: No
18:22 < rxr> yes - this is know
18:22 < rxr> nvidia replaces the GL libraries for T2 itself we need an alternative system for those files
18:23 < rxr> for the livecd we could jsut hack to copy them into the system if nvidia is detected - as quick hack
18:23 < tilix> in my distro, I did runtime linking
18:23 < tilix> but the module works ( I guess)
18:24 < tilix> ... in T2
18:24 < rxr> if graphic comes up, it works
18:24 < tilix> ohm. no nvidia logo
18:24 < rxr> hm - then it is not the right one ...
18:24 < rxr> did you comment out those xdetect lines ?
18:24 < tilix> i forgot
18:24 < tilix> i`ll try now
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18:26 < tilix> no nvidia logo, but the screen position changed (it happens when I enter an accelerated mode)
18:27 < tilix> this Load "GLX" from xorg.conf might be a problem
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18:27 < rxr> tilix: oh
18:28 < rxr> tilix: in what timeframe do you intend to migrate to t2 ?
18:28 < tilix> i havent decided yet. Why?
18:30 < rxr> just so ,-)
18:30 < rxr> for my mental planing
18:30 < mnemoc_> :)
18:30 < mnemoc_> tilix: what is your distribution about?
18:31 < tilix> General type, only in Bulgarian.
18:32 < mnemoc_> aha
18:32 < tilix> Localized version of Knoppix, with many new software and patches.
18:32 < tilix> useful for newbies
18:32 < rxr> hi mnemoc_
18:34 < tilix> rxr: I`ll migrate to T2 officially maybe when 2.2 is ready and stable.
18:34 < tilix> is it possible to have a package which provides /etc/skel/*?
18:35 < tilix> or I should specify those files somewhere else
18:35 < rxr> in your distribution you could extend sysfiles to place other content there ...
18:35 < rxr> or if you just want to add stuff - add another package
18:41 < mnemoc_> target/$target/pkg_sysfiles.conf overloads package/base/sysfiles/sysfiles.conf
18:41 < mnemoc_> so you have to 'source' original file before or after your changes
18:41 < mnemoc_> . $confdir/sysfiles.conf
18:42 < tilix> ok. thanks
18:43 < rxr> tilix: any chance you would jump in helping implementing it in the way useful for you ?
18:45 < tilix> i`ll try. what do you need?
18:45 < tilix> but it`s a minus for me that I don`t know the differences from Debian
18:46 < rxr> what do you mean ?
18:47 < tilix> where the different software is placed, for example
18:47 < rxr> like gnome or kde?
18:47 < tilix> I found them in /opt. Are there any BIG differences from Debian?
18:49 < rxr> I do not know debian in detail - but T2 is quite standard anyway
18:49 < rxr> you can also define your own prefix - e.g. if you want them in /usr you can tell T2 to build this way in your configuration or target
18:50 < rxr> locations should not be a big problem anyway - I mant more like geting dbus / hal running smoothly or your graphical installer or whatever you need for your distribution
18:58 < tilix> I`ll help with these things.
19:01 < CIA-1> rene * r8876 /trunk/package/base/sysfiles/ (initrdinit mkinitrd):
19:01 < CIA-1> * added preparing the /dev/fs symlink to the initrd
19:01 < CIA-1> * added the embutils ln to the initrd
19:01 < CIA-1> * fixed the /tmp as mounted by the initrd to be 1777
19:03 < rxr> manager.c/103: daemon exit: no point living
19:03 < rxr> ?!?
19:03 < rxr> I could slap the gome folks every new day ...
19:04 < rxr> tilix: which desktop environment do you use?
19:04 < mnemoc_> rxr: what was thata=
19:04 < mnemoc_> ?
19:05 < rxr> mnemoc_: what ?
19:06 < tilix> kde
19:06 < rxr> ah - good
19:06 < mnemoc_> rxr: no piot living thing
19:06 < rxr> don't as me - grep the gnome sources ...
19:06 < rxr> most probably the volume manager ...
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19:08 < mnemoc_> .oO( was the hal patch not enough? )o
19:08 < rxr> I don't know ...
19:08 < rxr> most probably the usual "unable to work working code problem" on the gnome site ...
19:08 < rxr> mnemoc_: btw. dbus and hal never worked in T2, the init scripts starting the daemons as well as the users have been missing ...
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19:19 < tilix> rxr: why the default cyrillic font is so ugly?
19:20 < rxr> tilix: no idea - never used them ,-)
19:22 < rxr> we have a xorg-cyrillic-fonts package - but it is not built by default
19:22 < rxr> no idea about the content - did not do that pkg ...
19:25 < tilix> only "terminus font" displays cyrillic in KWord
19:25 < rxr> mnemoc_: by default this hal stuff mounts to /media ... :-(
19:25 < rxr> should I try to patch this away ...
19:25 < mnemoc_> rxr: i use /media :p
19:25 < tilix> ... and everywhere
19:26 < mnemoc_> tilix: did you try xorg-cyrillic-fonts package?
19:26 < tilix> no, I`m running the LiveCD r9
19:27 < mnemoc_> rxr: do you know how to make tar to ignore path when extracting?
19:28 < rxr> mnemoc_: what kind of path? absolute one ?
19:28 < rxr> mnemoc_: you use /media ?
19:29 < mnemoc_> rxr: yes, absolute ones
19:29 < mnemoc_> rxr: yes, i do use /media
19:29 < mnemoc_> /media/{floppy,cdrom,cdrw,usb}
19:29 < rxr> why? there was /mnt in the past ...
19:30 < mnemoc_> T2 has /mnt on fstab
19:30 < mnemoc_> but _i_ like /media :p
19:30 < rxr> why the h*ll ?
19:30 < rxr> mnemoc_: hm - not off hand - I thought there was s.th. but can not locate it right now ...
19:31 < mnemoc_> i just got used to it
19:31 < mnemoc_> i also use /srv
19:31 < rxr> oh my god?
19:31 < rxr> why do you dare do this?
19:31 < mnemoc_> FHS :D
19:31 * rxr kicks mnemoc_
19:31 < mnemoc_> /srv is nice
19:31 < rxr> so is /var and whatever ...
19:32 < mnemoc_> it's a mount point for everything i serve
19:32 < rxr> why do we need incompatibly rotting stuff every few years ...
19:32 < rxr> just because SuSE or RedHat did it ...
19:32 < mnemoc_> nope
19:32 < mnemoc_> /srv is very usefull
19:32 < mnemoc_> /media ... i don't know
19:33 < mnemoc_> /srv/$client/$domain/$service
19:33 < rxr> ???
19:34 < rxr> mnemoc_: can you commit a 00-dirtree update to trunk - I do not want to make my handy dirty ...
19:34 < rxr> and since I fear patching all the next gen dbus / hal stuff will make me crazzy I consider just eating tis /media fluff - yuck
19:36 < mnemoc_> rxr: i commited part of it
19:36 < rxr> part ?
19:36 < mnemoc_> phoine
19:36 < mnemoc_> phone
19:36 < rxr> okok
19:40 < rxr> i c neither srv nor media in 00-dirtree
19:40 < mnemoc_> ok, i have my brain back
19:41 < mnemoc_> i have done nothing to 00-dirtree
19:41 < mnemoc_> what do you want me to commit there? /media and /srv ?
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19:44 < CIA-1> msluis * r8877 /trunk/package/java/maven/maven.desc: * updated maven 2 (2.0-alpha-1 --> 2.0-alpha-2)
19:56 < tilix> bye
19:56 < rxr> cu
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19:59 < mnemoc_> minto: here?
19:59 < minto> hi mnemoc :)
20:00 < mnemoc_> hi :)
20:00 < mnemoc_> can we talk about java?
20:00 < minto> Sure :)
20:01 < minto> I notices the new java-dirtree package
20:01 < mnemoc_> i want to install java tools at /opt/java and /opt/java/$JRE_OR_JDK
20:01 < mnemoc_> profile.d/java and profile.d/$JRE_OR_JDK
20:02 < mnemoc_> where profile.d/java set one $JAVA_HOME using a set of available options
20:02 < mnemoc_> java-conf.in will set JAVA_HOME during build using the same criteria
20:02 < mnemoc_> it's not an 'alternative system' but we need java working :)
20:03 < mnemoc_> minto: ?
20:03 < minto> I also want to postpone the real alternative stuff
20:03 < mnemoc_> we can't add a real alternative system to 2.1
20:03 < minto> I know
20:04 < mnemoc_> i'm looking for a solution on 2.1 first
20:04 < mnemoc_> but we don't want to change prefixes between 2.1 and 2.2
20:05 < mnemoc_> /opt/$JRE_OR_JDK leads to troubles on $PATH
20:05 < minto> The quick solution is transforming all profile.d/jdk in sun-jre-150 something like this
20:05 < mnemoc_> profile.d/java and profile.d/$JRE_OR_JDK <-- that :)
20:05 < mnemoc_> but they can't directly set JAVA_HOME
20:06 < minto> Uhmm? why not?
20:06 < mnemoc_> because you would get random result
20:06 < mnemoc_> if you have all JDKs and all JREs
20:07 < minto> Not random but not very predictable either
20:07 < mnemoc_> do you agree /opt/java for tools (ant, jikes,...) and /opt/java/$JRE_OR_JDK for $JRE_OR_JDK ?
20:07 < mnemoc_> 'unexpected results' :)
20:07 < mnemoc_> with /opt/$JRE_OR_JDK you _also_ get 'unexpected results' on PATH
20:08 < minto> Let me check I already have opt/java/$JRE_OR_JDK. Maybe not yet checked in.
20:08 < minto> it checked in.
20:10 < mnemoc_> does every JRE have a bin/java and every JDK have a bin/javac ?
20:10 < minto> Also profile.d/jre and profile.d/jdk are no longer used. Only the direct JAVA_HOME setting needs to be modified.
20:11 < minto> Most probably. But I noticed a difference with one of them. Don't know which one anymore.
20:11 < mnemoc_> i was thinking in having:
20:11 < mnemoc_> $ cat java
20:11 < mnemoc_> #!/bin/sh
20:11 < mnemoc_> exec $JAVA_HOME/bin/java $@
20:11 < mnemoc_> on opt/java/bin
20:12 < mnemoc_> so java gets into PATH
20:12 < minto> Nice thinking
20:13 < minto> This is what java-dirtree could do
20:13 < mnemoc_> yep
20:13 < mnemoc_> install profile.d/java, $bindir/java{,c} and providing java-conf.in during buildtime
20:13 < minto> But I like also to see jdk and jre separated.
20:13 < mnemoc_> JRE_HOME and JDK_HOME?
20:14 < minto> jdk = JAVA_HOME
20:14 < minto> jre = JRE_HOME
20:14 < mnemoc_> i don't use java, that's why i need to ask dumb stuff
20:14 < minto> It not dumb
20:14 * mnemoc_ taking notes
20:15 < minto> I am also working on a java-conf.in that makes compile java packages easy.
20:15 < minto> I should be able to build java packages based on apache ant of apache maven (1 or 2).
20:16 < minto> With possible auto detection.
20:16 < minto> If possible I want normal java packages with minimal .conf files.
20:16 < minto> if .conf is needed at all
20:17 < mnemoc_> that's the idea of $foo-conf.in files
20:18 < minto> Last time you mentioned a for loop to detect installed jdk and set JAVA_HOME accordingly.
20:18 < mnemoc_> can you commit your WIP java-conf.in to java-dirtree?
20:18 < mnemoc_> yes
20:18 < minto> Yes, makes discussion easier as well.
20:19 < mnemoc_> [O] . $base/package/*/java-dirtree/java-conf.in kaffe gcj
20:19 < mnemoc_> if they are supported
20:19 < mnemoc_> [O] . $base/package/*/java-dirtree/java-conf.in
20:19 < mnemoc_> if not
20:20 < mnemoc_> and: for jdk in $* sun-150 sun-142 ibm blackdown; do
20:20 < CIA-1> msluis * r8878 /trunk/package/java/java-dirtree/java-conf.in: * Added build support for ant, maven and maven2
20:22 < minto> Unfortunately I still have problems building a very small java package.
20:24 < mnemoc_> 00-jdk :p
20:24 < mnemoc_> should i rename java-dirtree to java-base ?
20:24 < minto> Ahh, remove it. It was my java-dirtree
20:24 < mnemoc_> rxr: here?
20:26 < mnemoc_> minto,rxr: java-dirtree or java-base?
20:27 < minto> mnemoc_: One of the problems I get is that JAVA_HOME is set to something outside the sandbox/target
20:27 < mnemoc_> uhm??
20:27 < mnemoc_> export :p
20:27 < minto> We can change the name later
20:27 < mnemoc_> it should work without exporting
20:28 < mnemoc_> minto: we need to get JDKs built before bdb
20:28 < minto> priorities need to change then
20:28 < mnemoc_> minto: because ooo mandates bdb java bindings these days
20:28 < mnemoc_> jikes after gcc
20:29 < mnemoc_> and JDKs after jikes and before bdb
20:29 < mnemoc_> or move them yo stage 3
20:29 < minto> Mostly JDK are only neede for building a target. Not for running it (JRE is needed)
20:30 < minto> Unless ofcourse the target is for developers
20:30 < minto> Does this justify moving jdk into stage 3?
20:30 < mnemoc_> JDK is not needed to build bdb bindinigs?
20:31 < minto> I am not sure, but I think it might be needed. But not for running the binding.
20:31 < minto> jdk is for building, jre is for running.
20:31 < mnemoc_> same case for gcc
20:31 < minto> To make it even complexer, every jdk as a jre as well.
20:33 < minto> Live CD might use jdk to build packages, but jdk does not need to be on the live cd to run. JRE (smaller) is used for that.
20:33 < mnemoc_> sure
20:34 < mnemoc_> but that is on install-time :p
20:34 < mnemoc_> priorities and stages are build-time only
20:35 < mnemoc_> i am worried about system .jar and .java files
20:35 < minto> I dunno when something should go into stage 3 and when not.
20:35 < minto> Why worry?
20:36 < mnemoc_> stage 3 is stuff built with the crosscompiled compiler needed by staff on stage>=3
20:36 < mnemoc_> which priorization is problematic inside stage 5
20:37 < mnemoc_> sometimes a package is built on a basic form on stage 3, to solve 'dependency loops'
20:38 < minto> Maybe we should first to try to get prio right
20:39 < mnemoc_> jikes after gcc
20:39 < mnemoc_> JDK needs JRE?
20:39 < mnemoc_> jdk after jikes and before bdb
20:39 < minto> no, jdk has jre
20:39 < mnemoc_> all JDKs in parallel
20:39 < minto> ack, I will give it a try
20:40 < mnemoc_> bdb will install it's .jar? on usr/ ... is that what we want?
20:41 < minto> Depends on where the java class loader is looking. Maybe /opt/java/lib is a better place.
20:41 < mnemoc_> ack
20:41 < mnemoc_> but we have to make 'java class loader' look there
20:42 < minto> that's what env var CLASSPATH is for
20:42 < mnemoc_> :D
20:43 < mnemoc_> so it wont be hard
20:43 < minto> I hope not
20:44 < rxr> re
20:44 < rxr> .oO(so much scrollback)
20:44 < rxr> 3044: 20:34:31.575: addon-storage.c:282: open failed for /dev/sda: Permission denied
20:45 < rxr> 3051: 20:32:45.701: probe-storage.c:160: Cannot open /dev/hde: Permission denied
20:45 < rxr> just to get some google hits on HAL crap ... ,-)
20:45 < mnemoc_> :D
20:45 < minto> Current priorities are:
20:45 < minto> gcc 102.300
20:45 < minto> jikes 550.000
20:45 < minto> jdk 800.000
20:45 < minto> bdb 107.000
20:46 < mnemoc_> and bdb33?
20:46 < mnemoc_> jikes to 103.000, and JDKs to 105.000?
20:46 < minto> bdb33 104.700
20:47 < mnemoc_> 104.500 :)
20:54 < rxr> || :
20:54 < rxr> ???
20:54 < rxr> in redhat specs ...
20:54 < mnemoc_> rxr: hi... do you want /srv and /media on 00-dirtree? i have done nothing yet on that field
20:54 < mnemoc_> nice atribute :)
20:56 < minto> mnemoc_: I made the changes, do I need to make a target with it?
20:57 < rxr> mnemoc_: yes, add them ... now that there is no way back with all the world using them ... :-((((((((
20:57 < mnemoc_> minto: why a target? sadly java is a part of our lives
20:57 < mnemoc_> rxr: ok
20:58 < minto> mnemoc_: How else to test?
20:59 < mnemoc_> "make a target" = Build-Target or mkdir target/minto-foo ?
20:59 < minto> build a target
21:00 < mnemoc_> :D
21:00 < mnemoc_> yes, sure
21:00 < minto> Might take a while then
21:00 < mnemoc_> but i was unable to build on trunk so i locally reverted 8811
21:01 < minto> What was unable to build?
21:01 < mnemoc_> gzip
21:02 < minto> Phhewww, so nothing I did
21:03 < minto> mnemoc_: we also have a java-conf.in in kaffe.
21:03 < mnemoc_> it has to be rmeoved
21:06 < CIA-1> msluis * r8879 /trunk/package/java/kaffe/java-conf.in: * java-conf.in now in java-dirtree. removed it from kaffe.
21:29 < minto> mnemoc_: Target building in progress. I have a very small target with jikes, sun java 1.5 jdk and bdb33
21:30 < mnemoc_> :D
21:31 < minto> mnemoc_: Testing prio changes does not make much sense. Testing all modified jdk's would take quite some time.
21:31 < mnemoc_> yep
21:33 < minto> I also made the prio of all jre the same a the jdk.
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21:36 < mnemoc_> yep
21:37 < minto> I have to quit now. I already did to much. I should not sit this long on a chair with my aching back.
21:37 < minto> I will tell you tomorrow how the build went. Although I think bdb still needs to have JAVA_HOME to be set properly.
21:37 < minto> cu all
21:41 < rxr> hm - gentoo only has hal 0.4.x ...
21:46 < mnemoc_> gentoo is crap :)
21:46 < mnemoc_> rxr: patching them is not to hard
21:47 < mnemoc_> rxr: api changes sucks
21:59 < valentin> rxr: throughout rocknet, there are many fullpaths missing
22:00 < valentin> so we should either push /sbin into Path on sudo or edit the rocknet modules
22:01 < mnemoc_> PATH= on top of rocknet script?
22:02 < valentin> would be a possibility
22:02 < valentin> but mom
22:04 < valentin> ok, we do not need that
22:04 < valentin> PATH=$PATH:/sbin/ sudo /sbin/ifup eth0 .....
22:04 < valentin> works, too
22:04 < mnemoc_> puaj
22:12 < rxr> valentin: please commit
22:12 < rxr> so - finally - /etc/fstab rewritten according to device plug
22:12 < rxr> damn hal crap ..
22:15 < CIA-1> amery * r8880 /trunk/package/base/00-dirtree/data.txt: * added /{media,srv} to 00-dirtree
22:16 < mnemoc_> minto: how is it going? does jikes build on that early prio?
22:19 < mnemoc_> three junk mails on the same day @ T2ML :D
22:19 < mnemoc_> we are getting popular
22:33 -!- sparc-kly [mubex@66-50-33-174.prtc.net] has joined #t2
22:36 < mnemoc_> netrunner: the policy for a 2.0.x is that 2.0.x.y contains only security fixes and tries to accomplish a maximum binary compatibility
22:36 < valentin> rxr: i use the path variant instead, because there are too many commands so it would need a big review
22:36 -!- keinek [~Keinek@201.254.11.121] has joined #t2
22:37 < keinek> hi
22:37 < mnemoc_> rxr: that was from th to netrunner ---^
22:38 < sparc-kly> damn it . live r9 . in my machine KDE crash
22:38 < sparc-kly> and automatically reboot
22:38 < mnemoc_> o_O
22:39 < sparc-kly> im sorry my english sucks . mnenoc traduce :
22:39 < sparc-kly> boteeo salen las X
22:39 < sparc-kly> KDE esta subiendo
22:39 < sparc-kly> sale lo de configurarle el idioma y esas cosas
22:39 < sparc-kly> pero sale como 7 veces
22:39 < sparc-kly> y el kde da start 7 veces.
22:39 < sparc-kly> y ahi se crashea
22:40 < sparc-kly> y bootie el cd 2 veces y la misma mierda
22:40 < mnemoc_> looping on language selection? and X crashing and respawing?
22:40 < sparc-kly> yep
22:41 < mnemoc_> valentin: ideas?
22:42 < sparc-kly> the real problem is kde language selection looping . and KDE start lopping . next X crash :S
22:43 < sparc-kly> i have AMD Xp 2000+ , 512 ram , Sis Motherboard all in one , and Nivida Gforece Mx 400 video card 64mb DDR .
22:44 < rxr> sparc-kly: I think I know the reason - wait for r10 tomorrow or so - should work fine then
23:02 < rxr> ok /me bed - n8 alll
23:03 < mnemoc_> n8 rxr
23:03 < sparc-kly> ok thanks
23:03 < sparc-kly> :D
23:03 -!- sparc-kly [mubex@66-50-33-174.prtc.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
23:08 < valentin> gn8 rxr
23:10 -!- minto [~chatzilla@82-217-66-7.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)]
23:53 < CIA-1> amery * r8881 /branches/2.1/package/printing/cups/cups.conf: * fixed cups to install setprinter_cups alternative handler
--- Log closed Sun May 15 00:00:49 2005